All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 140 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 10  Next
Author Message
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 23, 2010 9:33 pm 
Offline
Pwnzer
Pwnzer
User avatar

Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2005 11:20 pm
Posts: 2531
Damien wrote:
I like where this thread is going.

-better bullet penetration model for more than wood/tin metal
-bullet ricocheting

-weapon collision - when approaching a wall, the gun goes down, if a player uses walk mode, it stops him before the collision

-holster mode used for (before) freeclimbing and other interactions

-each item having it's weight with combined weight affecting the final player speed, freeclimbing abilities and stamina depletion

-having the ability to choose at least two main armor models, light for custom recon classes with less protection and heavy for assault classes.

-being able to drop items/weapons (pistols too :) and pick them up from corpses


good idea's, i think i suggested almost all the same thing you suggested a long time ago,

_________________
Image
call me Dragon


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 2:59 am 
Offline
Master
Master
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 1:38 am
Posts: 357
I had rather hoped that g_realism 1 would be to allow CQB to appeal to Tactical Realism Fans, NOT True Combat Fans that want 'a little more realism' that fits their idea/version fun. If the latter is the case, then all the concerns and paranoia about g_realism 1 fragmenting the prospective TC:E portion of CQB's fan base, and not appealing to Tactical Realism Fans at all are valid and relagates this thread, g_realism 1, and any TR Fan interest present or future in CQB to a dead end waste of time...

Tactical Realism design as far as what TR Fans covet is sometimes described with the design rule of thumb 'The wider the window is open the more shit blows through'. There are way too many bored kids that have way too much free time on their hands, and too little going on above the neck -- that for whatever reason get more enjoyment out of throwing games for others, then the fun they get out of playing with others.

What this means in practice is that if any jumping is offered in a TR game, someone will find means to exploit it, if mantling becomes free-climbing that is even remotely unrealistic in illustration -- someone will discover absurd arcade means to free-climb that exploit and obviate the design intention, and any premise that realistic tactics should always prevail is gone from the game for good.

Simple casual damage systems like the on in Raven Shield with no healing, absolutely no jumping in virtually any Tactical Realism game; no weapon, ammo, or magic pick-ups; limitations on turn speed and absolute run speed to constrain how the game is actually played in terms functional realism rather aesthetics or Hollywooden inspired possible-fantasy -- are design criterion that are decisive in appealing to TR Fans.

Just one simple illustration of what goes wrong in the balancing act of tactical game-play realism in the eyes of TR Fans (who WERE after all the target audience of this ONE thread) when basic design canon is subverted with 'possible' magic:

    A player is able to (unrealistically) sprint fast enough that s/he can sprint-flank, in the open, to a position of cover faster then a player that should easily have the easy drop on the sprinting player over such a distance can turn and place accurate lethal fire. Even worse, in TC:E it's not only possible but practical to flank a player in this way, and you can stop, turn, and fire on the stationary player that should have taken you down, and take him down -- consistently.
The typical solution is usually somthing 'cheap' (or worse something 'imaganiative') like cranking up the damage to an unrealistic level, which lowers bounding cover skill to luck-shot idiot spraying, and all play to cheap first hit decisive arcade tricks, rather then tactically realistic fire-maneuver skill.

:(


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 5:07 am 
Offline
Expert
Expert

Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:00 pm
Posts: 139
Gentleman, let me respectfully disagree.

I'll be honest with you, I've been a fan of 'TR' as you call it for a long time, and while I would not miss the jumping that much, it is sometimes necessary to have that ability.

What you are suggesting is to reduce the number of options available, possible movements and all. I believe jumping is a very human-like ability that can bring realism to a game if implanted correctly; 'corner-jumping' and the such is an different issue.

By leaving out jump, I believe we will miss out on the ability to reach otherwise unreachable areas. I'm not talking about map exploits, I'm talking about a platform, for example, that is entirely reachable for a real life soldier.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 5:41 am 
Offline
Master
Master
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 1:38 am
Posts: 357
Piney wrote:
Gentleman, let me respectfully disagree.

I'll be honest with you, I've been a fan of 'TR' as you call it for a long time, and while I would not miss the jumping that much, it is sometimes necessary to have that ability.

What TR games have you played that have jumping?

Piney wrote:
By leaving out jump, I believe we will miss out on the ability to reach otherwise unreachable areas. I'm not talking about map exploits, I'm talking about a platform, for example, that is entirely reachable for a real life soldier.

Coroner has stated CQB has object manteling at slow movement speeds in-game, or planned already -- which is far more realistic and makes everything that would be realistically 'reachable' accessible...

Why would you want to make g_realism 1 more like g_realism 0? What then is even the point of having the var?

:?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 6:30 am 
Offline
Expert
Expert

Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:00 pm
Posts: 139
Dear hoak,

Having read the new plans aimed at providing a g_realism 1 experience, I must object to the excessive measures you are proposing. I wish this pre-made template I found on the internet allowed me to formulate my disagreement without actually thinking, but it seams I will have to provide some real arguments. Please bear with me if this is not quite cohesive.

Coroner proposed g_realism as a hardcore setting for the game. If we dwell on this terminology, we can conclude he is referring to a CoD4-style hardcore mod. CoD4's hardcore mod provides tweaked weapon and hud settings, but no movement changes. As such, it is important to note that it is probably not in Coroner's plans to fork the game's development to provide an entirely different 'g_realism 1' subgame.

While reasonnable movement speed adjustements could be made to provide a realistic atmosphere, disabling jump and other such major changes would, in my oppinion, not benefit the community. TC:E as we know it is already quite arcadish, yet has appealed to this community. Coroner has already stated CQB will be a bit more focused on realism, and if g_realism 1 can take it a bit further, it is for the best, but do not take it too far.


I would urgently request that we hold a meeting to discuss fewer lay offs and alternative ways to improve the efficiency of the business. Please advise when this meeting can go ahead, and I await a time at your earliest convenience.

[Please disregard the last paragraph I could not find a 'strike-through' option.]

-piney


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 9:09 am 
Offline
Master
Master
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 1:38 am
Posts: 357
Piney wrote:
Coroner proposed g_realism as a hardcore setting for the game. If we dwell on this terminology, we can conclude he is referring to a CoD4-style hardcore mod. CoD4's hardcore mod provides tweaked weapon and hud settings, but no movement changes. As such, it is important to note that it is probably not in Coroner's plans to fork the game's development to provide an entirely different 'g_realism 1' subgame.

It was actually I that proposed g_realism years ago for TC:E and Coroner said he liked and would implement the idea. I agree that his latest nominclature harks to ditching g_realism for Modern Warfare's 'hardcore mode' which is not a realism mode at all -- if that's his intention it's obviously his perogative, but in that event this thread should be deleted as Modern Warfare and it's hardcore mode have abosolutely nothing to do with Tactical Realism or what the TR audience has been hoping for in a TC server options -- and this thread will do nothing but mislead wayward TR Fans that happen by...

Piney wrote:
While reasonnable movement speed adjustements could be made to provide a realistic atmosphere, disabling jump and other such major changes would, in my oppinion, not benefit the community. TC:E as we know it is already quite arcadish, yet has appealed to this community. Coroner has already stated CQB will be a bit more focused on realism, and if g_realism 1 can take it a bit further, it is for the best, but do not take it too far.

The premise and point made in this thread's topic post from get-go, in NYC Paramedic's posts, and others is that have favored g_realism 1 is a setting for Fans of Tactical Realism Games, NOT the True Combat Audience. Your comments make it clear you are not a TR Fan, don't understand the genera, how easily it's metrics could be applied to TC:E/CQB as server side vars, or the history of Fans requesting exactly this.

:?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 9:37 pm 
Offline
Pwnzer
Pwnzer
User avatar

Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2005 11:20 pm
Posts: 2531
i agree with hoak, there shouldnt be any jumping, operation flashpoint didnt had jumping either and to be honest, i didnt miss it,

_________________
Image
call me Dragon


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 10:45 pm 
Offline
Master
Master
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2009 4:01 pm
Posts: 459
I agree but if g_realism 1 with reduced/removed jumping becomes an option (and I sincerely hope it does), maps will have to be crafted so they work either way.

When it comes to rapid fire, a realistic time delay can be added between shots so no script can override it.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 5:35 pm 
Offline
Master
Master

Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2009 1:19 pm
Posts: 411
I think we shouldn't eliminate what others think, just because you disagree. This is a about a realistic var setting so lets just get it to something realistic instead of this.

"people shouldn't be allowed to jump or run cause that will make it harder to keep the teams as units. "
Cause to put it simply (as hoak never does) that's just bullshit.

_________________
"It's by doing whatever that you become whoever"


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:17 pm 
Offline
Master
Master
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 1:38 am
Posts: 357
Eqpe, by your own admission you're not interested in this thread, in g_realism as an option -- and you're fake quotes, continued insults, and histroincs just make you out to be a troll, you have nothing to offer this thread, please leave.

:!:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:34 pm 
Offline
Master
Master

Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2009 1:19 pm
Posts: 411
I would say the same thing for you. I made post just as valid as you did. I have never said I wasn't interested in a g_realism var but I did have objections when it were to be "released". The thing is that you can't have a discussion with you because everything you say is some kind of law.

Btw I thought you were the semi aggressive troll, that gets all involved, but leave after a short period of time.

To be on topic.

There aren't many TR fans around here (atleast not by your judgement) so the thing we need is some interested TR fans that can discuss in a civilized manner, and behave well while they can argue about different points of views.

QCB G_realism should just not be some rippoff from other games but it should instead have it's own design and stand out of the crowd from other well made realism games. If QCB were to hold kind of the same map design as tce does now, QCB should of course include a sprinting option.
People will simply have to put in more effort to keep the team together

EDIT: Would you mind to quote that admission I apparently made, it might have been misinterpreted or a mistake by me. If I were to actually have said I never wanted G_realism I do withdraw that statement and apology for that.

_________________
"It's by doing whatever that you become whoever"


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jul 26, 2010 8:41 pm 
Offline
Pwnzer
Pwnzer
User avatar

Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2005 11:20 pm
Posts: 2531
Dragonathan wrote:
im disappointed about the lack of interactiveness of the environment in 0.49,
in 0.48 i could shoot bottles and destroy it, in 0.49 the bullets dont even go through the bottles, it doesnt feel realistic, it feels more like decorations, i want to be able destroy allot of objects because that gives you that "real life feel"there are more things that i need to addres about the unrealistic things

example 1:
Image
Image
the bullet doesnt even hit the bottle, its unrealistic, what i suggest is something simple and what the wet engine is capable of, if you shoot at that bottle, it should be destroyed in small pieces, after the bottle is destroyed in small pieces, the small pieces should disappear just like when corpses disappear after a while. but thats more realistic than not being able to do nothing with the bottle.

example 2:
Image
i dont know who designed that ugly ass volvo, but it doesnt fit with tc:e's style, evrything looks so flawless on that map except those ugly volvo cars, i suggest to get rid of it because it ruins the whole map design. and i cant even shoot the windows of that car, and the car looks just like a square object with car textures sticked on evry surface, it doesnt look like a real car,
Image
and the windows of that truck above near the spawn of terrors in snow_town doesnt break either, im really confuse, you might think these are minor issue's, but it isnt really, especially when this game sepose to be realistic, and especially... if the wet engine is capable of making glass's break.

example 3:
Image
Image
the computer monitors in 0.49 are all fake and unrealistic, because if you shoot at the display of the monitor, it doesnt even break, devs are capable of making the monitor displays break into small pieces just like when you shoot at window glasses, so why not implement breakable displays on the monitors?

example 4:
Image
this is not as importent as example 1,2, and 3, but it would be awesome if you could open some closets, just to make the map feel really alive, and to make decorations look more realistic, it would be awesome if you could open that closet, and pick up a shotgun or small pistol with ammo's, this should be a sort of a hidden secret on a map, its just an idea,

all the things i suggested is pure for the realism, i really like to play on a map where evrything is interactive, because its makes the gameplay more immersive and in makes things feel more alive.

_________________
Image
call me Dragon


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2010 5:25 am 
Offline
Expert
Expert
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2010 6:36 pm
Posts: 128
Location: Finland
Maybe because its an test version? They were busy fixing bugs and didn't have time for little things like that in the maps.

_________________
In-game nick: vi$


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 5:43 am 
Offline
Master
Master
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 16, 2009 5:36 pm
Posts: 477
Few ideas come about some "hardcore" cqb :

* Only climb (laders or freeclimb) with "USE" (prevents unwanted situations).
* Nades break a glass and fall inside (actually easy bugfix).
* No health recovery (we arent aliens -> or bring medic class).
* More stamina time than TCE (super soldiers & cant sprint more than 60 meters ...) -> something to mix with "holster" ?
* Ability to push players (save blockers lives).
* Grenades should fly less than in .49b (0.48 nade setting was fine).

Anyway TCE is unique and have this special context that deserves to be more than a commercial_games/mixed clone.

_________________
Image
xFire : wootheyetti


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:56 am 
Offline
Master
Master
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 1:38 am
Posts: 357
:?: :?: :?:

I'd certainly appreciate a clarification from Coroner as to whether this will be a g_realism var as requested and discussed for many years now for more realism, or some Modern Warfare arcade deravitive g_hardcore var that has virtually nothing to do with functional tactical realism?

:?: :?: :?:


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 140 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 10  Next

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Style created by © Matti, gry komputerowe, reklama sem reklama seo

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group