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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2005 8:16 am 
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TheDamned wrote:
Yes, and the nade strength and level of effectiveness hasn't changed one iota in those five revisions.

Incorrect.

TheDamned wrote:
Coroner can embrace whatever theories and concepts you claim he has, yet there's still no playable evidence that anything can/has/will change with regards to nades.

Pars pro toto -- an invalid argument, what exists in the game as it stands is alpha, not definitive of the ultimate design intentions of the game's Developer except where specifically indicated, as clearly stated by the Lead Developer on numerous occasions...

TheDamned wrote:
And please refrain from "scolding" someone for something you have done yourself.

To correct someone, or argue is no the same as "scolding" -- it's an important distinction...

TheDamned wrote:
You dismissed the continuation of this thread by stating your beliefs that the discussion currently being held was moot without clear objective design premise.

Incorrect.

TheDamned wrote:
Obviously some of us have differing opinions.

Obviously, and just as obvious that was not the the point of my post; perhaps if you tried making an honest effort at reading for meaning, improved your vocabulary, and demonstrated some sincere and objective interest in the topic you could contribute more constructively to the thread.

TheDamned wrote:
We have a right to share those opinions, same as you. So kindly keep your reprimanding to yourself, hmm?

Incorrect, you have no "rights" on these fourms, they are privately owned. Moreover argument through distortion by calling my posts "repremands" so that you can suggest I do not have a right to counter argue with valid points is simply fallacious, petty, dirt tactics...

TheDamned wrote:
Given what i've seen both in the online community of TCE and with countless hours of playing this game, the dynamics that have evolved within the players strategy and team cooperation as well as map layouts simply don't support (yes, in my opinion) a higher, realistic flash grenade.

Your "opinion" is noted by all concerened I'm sure; but is completely unsupported with any facts, evidence or even examples to illustrate an arugment -- and does not even argue the point I was making...

TheDamned wrote:
Can all of the above change to accomodate more realism so that some old fart can sit back and say "my, that's just like it was in the force?

Now your getting petty, hostile, provocative, insulting, personal, and aren't even remotely on topic -- why not stick to the "Official True Combat: Elite Fourms where this kind of crap is par for the course, enjoyed and indulged.

TheDamned wrote:
I am all for seeing a realistic, tactical game with relative scale hit the market. However, being a loyal follower of TCE, I also wish to see a finished, playable package that is fun, and not a mismatched grabbag of theories and facts that ruin the essence of the gameplay.

Well if any TC:E Developer approches game design with the same kind of nonsequiturs and circular reasoning you're using, a "grabbag of theories and facts that ruin the essence of the gameplay" is certain to be the result.

TheDamned wrote:
Now, IN MY OPINION the game as it stands has a unique level of playability and an essence of fun that I, as well as numerous others can enjoy.

Numerous others? I beg to differ, less then 1/20 of 1% of people playing Enemey Territory and Enemy Territory mods plays True combat: Elite; fewer the 4000 people ever play the mod -- that is not a sustainable audience, and is hardly a good measure of strong game appeal.

While I agree that True Combat: Elite has promise, with some of the talent it has on board; as it exits it's nothing more then unoriginal Counter-Strike derivative... While there's nothing wrong with that, there are over 400 other games and mods that are Counter-Strike derivative, many of wich attract and sustain much larger audiences and many of which will draw on True Combat: Elite's audience if the game does not evolvoe along some of the lines promosed. And that last point is the essence of why I contineu to post in this thread.

TheDamned wrote:
I wish to see some things improved, and others changed utterly, but what I DON'T wish to see is another 3 years of waiting for a game which is, in it's beta testing already gaining a rather fanatic following, while the developers try to decide exactly how much weight the word "true" in True Combat should hold.

The only thing I agree with in this rant is that TC:E current following is fanatic and in every unfortunate regard that term can apply to a game Fan: hostile, cliqueish, destructive...

I would rather a sustainable game that took three years to develop r (along any lines Coroner pleases), rather then one that was released soon and fell flat in three years... Most importantly I hope TC:E will be rreleased with the Mod-On-Mod support features Coroner promises (and then some) so that interested Fans that want a serious Tactical Realism game, (and don't have one as the genre's largest developer has abandoned the genre) which now number at nearly three times the playing Enemy Territory audience can have a relatively current game engine to bring their talent, more mature approch to realism gameing and enthusiasm to...

Regarding your dirt shots at Flyhead"

TheDamned wrote:
You have just shown your own age by this post. I happen to know that the majority of the bastards that are derailing this topic are from Norway and Sweden. . . NOT America.

He's done nothing to "show his age" or even reveal his level of maturity, he's expressed his annoyance which in terms of fact is warranted and valid.

TheDamned wrote:
Kindly refrain from making broad generalizations, as it generally serves no purpose other than showing what an assclown you are.

Wow, what a loaded pile of shit for a remark/suggestion that is, "Kindly", and then you call or imply HE is an "AssClown" -- you won that prize for your instagating relentless personal attacks rather then approching the subject matter germane to threads long ago...

hagenisse wrote:
BlaBlaBla, I hate Hoak, thinking, honest people, black people and life... While red orchestra is a great game and the nade damage is more or less perfect, its also very different from TC:E. It got big open maps, not the chokepoint based (crap) maps we have in tc:e. There is enough nade spam as it is in tc:e and making nades (and flashes) more powerful will certainly not reduce that.

Big mistake, you picked a game I worked on; not only is Red Orchestra's grenade handling, grenade physics, and grenade damage more realistic then TC:E -- Red Orchestra's most popular maps by over six orders of magnitude are urban maps that have an effective play area that is roughly the same size, scale, effective bounding areas, and density of TC:E's urban maps...

Δ


Last edited by hoak on Thu Sep 08, 2005 10:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2005 8:58 am 
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chinese people are meant to be forgiving, so ill ignore TheDamned's remark about me being an assclown. if you really were to insult me, wouldn't asshat have sounded better?

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2005 10:53 am 
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Flyhead, your English is amazing, especially your knowledge of colloqualisms -- what part of China are you from?

:?:


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2005 11:56 am 
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omg hoad.. the arrogance.. you really think you are important around here right? Short analysis tells me almost all your posts are like the next 3 steps:

1. make a smoke curtain by telling the next things will be opinions, pointing to others, throwing some figures and statistics based on nothing, stating some 'incorrects' not explained to us low lifes, and writing huuuuge sentences.

2. Give your own following story some weight with sentences as "when i worked on that one" or "back in those days we introduced" etc etc. Can you please give us some real evidence of things you created and targets reached?

3. Give a huuuuge story with colorized words, camouflaging long sentences etc etc

and bonus step 4: the 1337 Δ at the end :p

sorry for my bad English as i'm from Holland.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2005 12:55 pm 
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Marksman
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hoak wrote:
Big mistake, you picked a game I worked on; not only is Red Orchestra's grenade handling, grenade physics, and grenade damage more realistic then TC:E -- Red Orchestra's most popular maps by over six orders of magnitude are urban maps that have an effective play area that is roughly the same size, scale, effective bounding areas, and density of TC:E's urban maps...

RO is bigger and has far more advanced maps and objectives (it even has vehicles on some maps ffs). Also, the standard weapons has one shot meaning that run and gun is out of the question. And then there is the respawning. All this makes RO play very differently from TC:E. TC:E's nades in RO would be completly useless, and the other way around would be spam-o-mania.

And Guerilla, you forgot:

5) Calling everyone that not agrees with him rude, hostile, immature or not honest while his own opinions is facts

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2005 1:14 pm 
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Sharp Shooter
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hoak wrote:
Regarding your dirt shots at Flyhead"

He's done nothing to "show his age" or even reveal his level of maturity, he's expressed his annoyance which in terms of fact is warranted and valid.



Allow me to repaste for you what he wrote, since he felt the need to erase it:

flyhead wrote:
in my opinon twelve year old kids should *i-need-a-broader-vocab* off and go read books or smth.. what is it with american kids? they think they're so cool just cos they're american and can bitch about anything and get away with it.. dont ever let me see you in hong kong.


Nothing in there is warranted nor valid, since as i've said before the majority of the pissing and moaning and derailing has been enacted by people known to be NOT American. Not to mention the fact that he obviously doesn't know anyone's age in the forum unless they've posted it. Thus my remark about his own age.

This was no dirt shot, this was a return salvo, as Flyhead is the one that pulled the trigger first by making such a broad and ridiculously childish generalization about an entire country that he apparently knows little about.

And as for you, my dear Hoak. You show every appearance of being a man entirely too full of himself. I've been attempting to have some sort of thought-producing converstation, and you've attempted to both discredit and derail my "opinions" at every turn. Very unappreciated. You are the single most long-winded forum poster I have come accross in quite some time, and to be quite honest, I fail to see how anyone anywhere can withstand the presence of your over-enlarged ego.

The concept of having a "public forum" is for both ideas and concepts to be discussed thoughtfully. You however continue to go about with the theory that "you are right, everyone else can go to hell and here is a 12 page cut and paste from some war novel to prove it!"

¬

Edit, to try and get on track ONCE MORE:

Oh, *i-need-a-broader-vocab* it, it's not even worth it.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2005 2:27 pm 
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Flyhead did generalize americans and not realizing the posters were far from americans, that touched a nerve on me as well but I let that slide. People can hate America just based off the liberal media that's fine, I understand propoganda....

I dont think the nades should be more powerful only due to the fact right now most maps have those choke points which already take people out.... adding a higher radius of damage may cause a spam fest, it may not. There are no facts around that, but no substance in the other direction either.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2005 5:24 am 
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alright this is turning nasty.. forget me and continue with the flashbangs.. i dont want any friendships or hatreds starting cos of my stupid words. actually ive been to america shitloads of times but never bothered to notice what was around me.. :| :(

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2005 7:49 am 
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Flyhead is right, this has turned into nothing but relentless idiotic personal attacks disguised as a game design descussion, but I refuse to stand by and let the abuse fly without comment.

Guerilla wrote:
omg hoad.. the arrogance..

It's: H O A K, four letters and not hard to spell... How exactly is it that you find game design discussion and the desire to keep discussion german and on topic "arrogant", but personalized insults, baseless hostile remarks -- all of which are clearly in abrogation of the Forum Policy & Terms Of Use agreement you accepted when you registered on these forums, acceptable?

Guerilla wrote:
you really think you are important around here right?

Important around here? No, but a more civil and constructive person then somone like you that starts and fills his post with insults -- you bet!

Guerilla wrote:
Short analysis tells me almost all your posts are like the next 3 steps...

Why don't you get off your lazy obnoxious ass, and try making the honest effort of the long analysis before trolling a thread off topic and lambasting people with baseless personalized insults, insinuations, and remarks...

Guerilla wrote:
1. make a smoke curtain by telling the next things will be opinions, pointing to others, throwing some figures and statistics based on nothing, stating some 'incorrects' not explained to us low lifes, and writing huuuuge sentences.

Making a clear distinction between fact and opinion is not "a smoke screen" (perhaps you need to work on the English comprehension skills...), the statistics I posted are about game popularity are from CSports, and RO Stats, can be easily corroberated, and are very conservative.

Something that is simply false, based on a premise of insults, or is a gross misinterpretation of what someone else has said along the lines of "So, Guerilla, you're saying you're a NeoNazi Raceist, that hates all Americans and feel you have the right to troll any U.S. Forum and insult people on that basis alone..."... Fun hun? Remarks like that aren't worht my time or effort in explaining how incorrect or stupid they are.

Guerilla wrote:
2. Give your own following story some weight with sentences as "when i worked on that one" or "back in those days we introduced" etc etc. Can you please give us some real evidence of things you created and targets reached?

Yes I can, can you?

Guerilla wrote:
Give a huuuuge story with colorized words, camouflaging long sentences etc etc

Try that in English, and if comprehending and writing in English is too challenging for you, this is not the fourm for you -- it is after all True Combat U.S....

Guerilla wrote:
and bonus step 4: the 1337 Δ at the end :p

How is including a Greek letter that also happens to be a letter indicating an affiliation I'm proud of germane to anything? Does your same criticism then not apply to those that use Avatars and have weird advertising banners at the ends of thier posts? How about your assinine, and anonymously cowardly nick?

Guerilla wrote:
sorry for my bad English as i'm from Holland.

Perhaps you should use it on people from Holland, or on "Thee Official True Combat: Elite Fourms" where this kind of abuse is appreciated and enjoyed...

TheDamned wrote:
And as for you, my dear Hoak. You show every appearance of being a man entirely too full of himself.

Care to support that personal acusation with something like facts or even evidence? You do offer concrete evidence that you are in fact rude, sarcastic, hostile and can't tolerate disagreement. In just 16 posts to this forum you've insulted people 19 times, used sarcasim 11 times, and posted more exceptions to other peoples posts solely based on your very important "OPINIONS". How does that make you less "full of yourself" then someone that pefers to discuss game design in terms of fact, example and illustration?

TheDamned wrote:
I've been attempting to have some sort of thought-producing converstation...

If that's true why do you incessently instigate and provoke people with personalized insults, name calling, swearing and why are your posts dripping with hostile and condescending sarcasim... How is that "thought-producing converstation" in any way other then hostile thoughts?

TheDamned wrote:
...and you've attempted to both discredit and derail my "opinions" at every turn. Very unappreciated.

You're certainly entitled to feel discredited and derailed if you please, but I'm not discussing or interested in discussing feelings or opinion, that isn't grounded in evidence or at least example and illustration. You can say you "feel" that True Combat: Elite should have player models that are calming fluffy pink bunnies because of your anger management issues -- that doesn't offer a basis for your opinion that others can relate to or value


TheDamned wrote:
You are the single most long-winded forum poster I have come accross in quite some time, and to be quite honest, I fail to see how anyone anywhere can withstand the presence of your over-enlarged ego.

If you have issues with reading comprehension, and discussiong game design issues that require an elaborate or abstract illustration -- don't do it. If you find my posts too long to read: don't read them. If you have emotional issues with my posts and belive you can judge people by forum posts on game design -- seek professional help, you're going to need it....

TheDamned wrote:
The concept of having a "public forum" is for both ideas and concepts to be discussed thoughtfully.

Yes, please try that, and keep the insults, sarcasim, hostility, and name calling to yourself... They are clearly in abrogation of the Forum Policy & Terms Of Use agreement you accepted when you registered on these forums, and posted to them...

TheDamned wrote:
You however continue to go about with the theory that "you are right, everyone else can go to hell and here is a 12 page cut and paste from some war novel to prove it!"

Those words are all yours and yours alone, nowhere in any post on these fourms do I use language like that, or that even implies anything remotely like that. Never have I cut and pasted 12 pages of text from anything, never have I suggested that a quote from anyone or anything proves anything. Never have I told or even implied anyone can or should "go to hell"...

A more likely possibility is that you have confrontation and self-esteem issues -- and can't tolerate being taken exception to.

Δ


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2005 12:01 pm 
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Marksman
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hoak wrote:
It's: H O A K, four letters and not hard to spell... How exactly is it that you find game design discussion and the desire to keep discussion german and on topic "arrogant", but personalized insults, baseless hostile remarks -- all of which are clearly in abrogation of the Forum Policy & Terms Of Use agreement you accepted when you registered on these forums, acceptable?

LOL, and that comes from the guy that never has spelled my nick correct even with 2+ years and a shitload of posts to try to do it.

Quote:
Those words are all yours and yours alone, no where in any post on these fourms do I use language like that, or that even implies anything remotely like that. Never have I cut and pasted 12 pages of text from anything, never have I suggested that a quote from anyone or anything proves anything.


Toad...err hoak.. When he writes "12 pages" like he did there, he doesnt mean 12 pages literally. He just means that you paste from other sources a lot. And of course you didnt use the exact language either, its just a way of saying things. Maybe you should work on your english skills? it is after all True Combat U.S....

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2005 12:05 pm 
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hagenisse wrote:
I'm going to troll Hoak's posts where ever he posts! I hate Hoak because, well I don't have a reason, I just do, it makes me so emotional I want to stuff cheese up my nose and pencils in my ass....

I love trolling, it's my favorite past time!

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2005 12:08 pm 
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I see. Another interesting post on game-design. You're the man hoak.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2005 12:50 pm 
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Sharp Shooter
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Hoak, you are a marvel at taking bits and pieces of quotes and writing you're own stories up about them. You should seriously consider being an author. . . For the army . . . . you know, since noone else really cares about the differences between a clip and a magazine.


Nice triangle at the end of your posts btw, adds character.

¬


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2005 1:15 pm 
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Sharp Shooter
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My god, my *i-need-a-broader-vocab* eyes are bleeding ffs! I want to hear more about flashbangs, what changes can be made that is good for the mod/community.

Or can we add a troll class along with recon/sniper, etc?


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2005 9:02 pm 
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Marksman
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2 things hoaK,

1. neonazist? excuse me?
2. working on my English grammar? How is your Dutch if I may ask?

/me signes off

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