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PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2007 10:07 pm 
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Karate Explosion wrote:
i think some minor product placement wouldn't be too bad as long as the community knows it is there to help the game


product placement isnt such a bad idea, but you get a better chance if you seek companies who has knowledge about the gaming scene,

such as:
http://www.giga.de/
www.gametrailers.com
www.ign.com
www.gamekings.tv

and perhaps some other known gaming magazines,

u get a better chance in cooperating with those companies i mentioned, because they have knowledge about the gaming industry,

i suggest the devs to give it a try, and i wouldnt advice to ask the companies a monthly fee of more than 50,000 or something, start with reasonable indie prices such as 60euro/90euro per month per company, that would be a more attractive price for companies that are going to advertise TCe,

now u probably think, 60 or 90 euro is nothing, but if there are 5 companies advertising TCe, u get a reasonable amount of money, and thats not bad for a "indie" development team,

i suggest that the "product placement/advertisement" should appear during the loading screen,

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Last edited by Dragonathan on Sun May 06, 2007 2:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2007 11:31 pm 
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Ingame ads wont help make the game popular at all. Most of the monet the devs have that go into this development probably come from that tiny google ad at the bottom of this page. We either sell more room for add and make the site look ugly or stick with donations.

If advertising to make TCE popular was the idea, spending money on it is out of the question however we do get plenty of attention in various modding websites and download websites.

-------------

As for the loading screen I dont think the source code EULA allows that either. We can't make any more out of a game that doesnt belong to us. Since TCE is merely a mod for a game made by someone else, TT therefore cannot make any money out of it without the express permission of the original creators.

So, the options are:
Website ad space
Online store
Donations
or remake the game in an in-house engine (nolonger a mod but a full game not using any proprietary ready made engines specifically the GPL kind - if they do this, monthly fees and even retail prices are possible)

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PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2007 2:37 am 
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XenoKiLLer wrote:
Ingame ads wont help make the game popular at all.

If advertising to make TCE popular was the idea


euhmm, have i ever mentioned on this thread about making the game popular? guess not huh, this thread is about how the devs can make money, so stay on topic, and just a small advice, read everything attentively, and dont skip, and try to memorize everything,
XenoKiLLer wrote:
As for the loading screen I dont think the source code EULA allows that either. We can't make any more out of a game that doesnt belong to us. Since TCE is merely a mod for a game made by someone else, TT therefore cannot make any money out of it without the express permission of the original creators.


your wrong, thinking doesnt get u the facts right, get the facts first than think, than post,

its only illegal if u sell ET, and benefit money by selling ET/the software,
adding advertisement in the loading screen isnt illegal, cause ur not selling the product, u just benefit money from the product, wich is completely legal,
its like putting the title TRUE COMBAT on the main menu,
or putting a clan tag on the loading screen,

trust me its not illegal,
and trust me, advertisement on the loading screen wont affect TCe's popularity, its a free game, dont forget that,

u dont need a stand alone game to earn money,
all u need is clever marketing,

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PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2007 2:52 am 
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from the ET EULA:

Quote:
You shall not rent, sell, lease, lend, offer on a pay-per-play basis or otherwise commercially exploit or commercially distribute the New Creations...

...You, whether directly or indirectly, shall not do any of the following acts...

...in any other manner and through any medium whatsoever commercially exploit the Software, or use the Software for any commercial purpose, including, without limitation, giving away copies of the Software for free to promote or market any other material


sections two and three, licence.rtf, in your documentation folder in your enemy territory directory.

adding advertisements would violate these two clauses. if you want, I can go and ask on the splashdamage forums.

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PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2007 2:58 am 
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Even though it is TCE you are selling the mod still uses WET's base structure and the Quake3 engine (GPL or not) having na price to play the game, by subscription or ads just wont work.

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PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2007 3:10 am 
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XenoKiLLer wrote:
Even though it is TCE you are selling the mod still uses WET's base structure and the Quake3 engine (GPL or not) having na price to play the game, by subscription or ads just wont work.


like i said, its not selling, its the same like adding a clan tag on the loading screen, or putting the titel TRUE COMBAT on the main menu,
and they cant sue the devs because they earn money from the advertisements on the loading screen,
if a clan that used the TCe mod to change the loading screen into their own designs with their own clan tags, and donated money trough TCe's paypal donation, would the devs get sued? no...

bend the rules buddy,

just look at it this way, if IGN or whatever company advertised their company on the loading screen, than just think that they are modders, modding ET, modding is legal, putting your team name on the loading screen is legal,

if u say its illegal is like saying that its illegal to put TT and G6S tags on the main menu, or saying that its illegal if Groove 6 studio gives money to Team terminator, get the point?

as long the devs dont sell the product,

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PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2007 4:09 am 
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Technically having those logos there isnt advertising just so you know. They arent selling anything or making any money from it either.

Donations isnt earning money from the WET and idSoftware assets, it is people giving them money to continue devloping the mod voluntarily. However if they asked people to pay that they can develop this mod, calling it subscription fee or not that is illegal. Clans modify the loading screens with logos doesnt mean they are advertising themselves for money, that idea which is pretty weird as why would they want people to pay for them.

As the EULA points out, adding product advertisements which you intend to use to earn money using idSoftware games (via mods) is illegal and yes, idsoftware can sue for much more than the devs will earn by advertising there in the first place.

This is real life, real life has set rules which you must follow. None of these rules are to be bent or youll find yourself bending cloth hangers in jail.

Quote:
just look at it this way, if IGN or whatever company advertised their company on the loading screen, than just think that they are modders, modding ET, modding is legal, putting your team name on the loading screen is legal,


but having other companies pay you, or in anycase give you money to put their name and logo in it is ILLEGAL. IGN does not advertise ingame unless that game does has an ingame ad service to begin with. Infact ads in games only came in recently with the free multiplayer game design. Games like BF2142 and several MMOs which feature free to play multiplayer use ads to fund servers.

If you do not believe us that it is illegal why dont you contact idSoftware themselves. On the otehr hand why not get us and idsoftware on IRC.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Look here, legal issues are somethings TCE doesnt need right now. Groove 6 giving money to TT to help develop the game is different from Groove 6 giving TT money to put their ad on the loading screen and expect to get profit.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Refer to the WET EULA and the WET source code and modding EULA aswell as the legal documentation for all UQkae3 engine based games, last I recall available over at id's FTP server.

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PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2007 5:09 am 
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well product placement = no it seems back to my first idea ................porn?

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PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2007 2:39 pm 
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XenoKiLLer wrote:
Look here, legal issues are somethings TCE doesnt need right now. Groove 6 giving money to TT to help develop the game is different from Groove 6 giving TT money to put their ad on the loading screen and expect to get profit.


its the same thing if IGN or GIGA gives money to TeamTerminator/groove 6 studio, its also to help to develop the game, get it?
iDsoftware doesnt necessarily have to consider the modified loading screen as an advertisement, u even said it yourself:
XenoKiLLer wrote:
Clans modify the loading screens with logos doesnt mean they are advertising themselves for money, that idea which is pretty weird as why would they want people to pay for them.

how would iDsoftware prove that the company is paying TT/G6S?
an individual of the company is paying the devs, so? what if that individual is part of the dev team? like u said, is just to help them help develop the game, just like G6S is giving money to TT, its not illegal,

bend the rules buddy,

i think u just hate to see the advertisements on the loading screen, you even admit it, if this is true, than your selfish, keep in mind that the devs have to keep making new steps, devs will need to have money if they want to make this project survive longer, if the devs have allot of money to better the game, than us players can benefit from it, and who doesnt want that?
probably the one's that mind the advertisements on the loading screen, :roll:

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Last edited by Dragonathan on Sun May 06, 2007 5:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2007 4:41 pm 
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if it could make money, I would be 100% for ads on loading screens. but it is ILLEGAL.

and when clans advertise, they make no money. at all. it is not commercial.

if advertising was used in-game in TC:E, it would be a violation of the EULA, and would probably cost the devs about $10000 ish, after legal fees.

IN-GAME ADVERTISING IS ILLEGAL. id SOFTWARE'S LAWYERS DON'T CARE IF WE ONLY BEND THE RULES A LITTLE. IF WE ADVERTISE FOR MONEY IN-GAME, THEY WILL SUE TT AND G6S INTO OBLIVION.

and it's not really bending the rules. it's completely breaking the rules in two places.

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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 10:08 am 
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Dragon it would be wise to stop right now. You do know we do NOT DELETE these threads and as you say; "how will they find out?" They can look in the forums: you are basicaly conspiring to commit criminal offense, that by itself is also a crime.

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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 11:26 am 
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If the devs really needed money they could sell their selves to the night. I make over 1000dollars a night being a transvestite hooker with one breast.

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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 5:42 pm 
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XenoKiLLer wrote:
Dragon it would be wise to stop right now. You do know we do NOT DELETE these threads and as you say; "how will they find out?" They can look in the forums: you are basicaly conspiring to commit criminal offense, that by itself is also a crime.


lol, why are you so overconcerned, u need to stop being worried,
i know your a canadian and a very good civilian, but u just need to be more layd back, just cill nothing's bad is going to happen,

i have a clan member that makes maps and is hosting a server for my clan, he changed the loading screen and added a clan logo in the loading screen, now i am paying him,
because i have to pay for the server as well, well im not arrested or something, thats for one, and im not doing something illegal, im just paying him not for the logo he have put on the loading screen, but for the server,

now if IGN GIGA or whatever company is paying the devs, doesnt mean necessarily that they are paying the devs because the devs added their company logo on the loading screen, could for be for allot of reasons why they are paying,

you just have stop being over concerned, im sure if the merchendises wasnt available that you would wine like crazy about legal issue's if i suggesed that the devs should sell merchendises,

just say it, say "i dont want advertisements" instead of giving excuses why the devs shouldnt do it,

and if your still over concerned,

than a second option is possible, the download page could have advertisements of other companies, devs could put like some logo's of different company's in the download page where people are going to download the TCe file,

but i think the advertisers prefer my first idea,

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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 6:27 pm 
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okay, gloves are off:

ADVERTISING IN-GAME IS ILLEGAL IF YOU MAKE MONEY. PERIOD. YOU ARE SUGGESTING THE DEVELOPERS BREAK THE LAW. THERE IS NO WAY YOU CAN "BEND" THE RULES ON THIS!!

thread locked, it is getting no-where, and is involving illegal activity.

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